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Post by kgp on Oct 25, 2007 17:25:41 GMT -5
My only issue with the way it's executed here is putting current quotes alongside old quotes when talking about the same situation. When you have Slim or Peter talking now, with the benefit of 20 years of hindsight and perspective, next to quotes from Paul or Tommy that are contemporary to the time period they happened, it's a bit skewed. But I don't see any way around that since Paul, Tommy and Chris didn't chose to be interviewed for the book. Yep. I understand, though, after reading Walsh's Harp interview why he opted against it. The early stuff was nice to have. Paul rarely talks about his childhood. (My theory is that there's not much to tell -- just a normal, kind of dorky kid, which apparently was the case. And that's fine. If you're going into it looking for "dirt" you're not going to find any.) I just wanted to add that after picking through some of the quotes-- Slim's, the fans', people who knew them when --it's hard to get read on Paul. It's like I have all these images of him that I want to put together like Russian stacking dolls: the quiet, dorky kid; the never-been-kissed 15-year-old at his first concert; the lead singer with stage fright; the genius songwriter, etc... one on top of another, and it still doesn't give you a complete picture.
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Post by Stegman on Oct 26, 2007 9:14:55 GMT -5
I think you're overestimating Slim's input into those last two albums...particularly All Shook Down. Paul (and/or the label) made the decision to go with bigger production, and I'm sure the inclusion of clean, traditional solos was made by the producer, engineer, mixer...and Paul. I agree completely. I always got the sense that Slim was just a hired gun. An excellent guitar player who was probably given pretty clear instructions about what they were looking for in each song. Then he simply went out and executed it like a session man.
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Post by nowwesayitoutloud on Oct 26, 2007 11:36:47 GMT -5
I just wanted to add that after picking through some of the quotes-- Slim's, the fans', people who knew them when --it's hard to get read on Paul. It's like I have all these images of him that I want to put together like Russian stacking dolls: the quiet, dorky kid; the never-been-kissed 15-year-old at his first concert; the lead singer with stage fright; the genius songwriter, etc... one on top of another, and it still doesn't give you a complete picture. Having read the book (to quote Lennon) I have come around from opposing to appreciating the oral history format. I don't want a complete picture after all. I don't want a narrator or a thesis. I want the odd fact, the weird recollection, the simmering anger, the mystery left in the end unexplained. If anything, Walsh's book may be too neat and polite. Maybe a web-based format or DVD that leaves you whistling and scratching your head is the next Replacements "book" to be written ... something chaotic as a Grandpaboy sleeve.
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ih8music
Star Scout
couldn't be happier.
Posts: 943
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Post by ih8music on Oct 26, 2007 14:55:13 GMT -5
I agree completely. I always got the sense that Slim was just a hired gun. An excellent guitar player who was probably given pretty clear instructions about what they were looking for in each song. Then he simply went out and executed it like a session man. that's what strikes me the most in watching various concert footage on youtube... Slim is just kinda there, playing fine and all, but with virtually no charisma. No wonder I have no recollection of him from the concerts I attended at the time, I was always focused on Paul & Tommy (& chris, to a much lesser extent). Wish I could have caught the band in person with Bob playing lead.
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Post by kgp on Oct 26, 2007 17:58:53 GMT -5
Loved the Grant Hart/Paul/Mould bitchiness at the Karl thing. I had to go back and find that. Bob Mould and Paul Westerberg = frenemies.
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davpel1
Dances With Posts
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Post by davpel1 on Oct 26, 2007 23:35:19 GMT -5
I'm really enjoying the book, but one of the side effects of reading it are flashbacks to "scary Paul." After the last few solo tours, with impromptu meet and greets on the tour bus, inviting fans on stage to sit on the couch, etc., I had almost forgotten how surly (and sometimes downright mean) PW could be to fans, writers, bandmates, etc. I love the guy, but he has always intimidated me. Reading some of these stories, I now remember why.
Funny, the book mentions John Lydon quite a bit, and I've always felt the same about him as well. Two guys who will simply bite your head off if you catch them in the wrong mood or say the "wrong" thing. Feel the same way about Elvis C. for some reason, too.
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Post by longplayer on Oct 27, 2007 22:39:19 GMT -5
Paul Westerberg-"We named it Tim for no reason at all".This was the first time we named an album after it was done.We sat around a bar,we were gonna call it Whistler's Mammy,Van Gogh's Ear,or England Schmingland."I think I said Tim and we sat and laughed for a few minutes and then we said,"Why not?"
The story I heard was they originally wanted to call it Tommy like the classic Who album-but the Who wouldn't allow it so they changed it to Tim instead
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Post by nowwesayitoutloud on Oct 28, 2007 19:52:46 GMT -5
Pick six (MPLS Star Tribune) A half-dozen cool things in music, from two points of view: Last update: October 26, 2007 – 12:02 PM "The Replacements: All Over but the Shouting" by Jim Walsh. A loving, lyrical, sometimes messy and therefore perfect oral history of a band that, previous to this testimonial, I couldn't understand. It is so filled with local lore, insight and punk rock poetry that I could read it only in silence because if I held it close I would need earplugs. — RACHEL HAGER, MINNEAPOLIS
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Post by tmcgovern on Oct 29, 2007 21:29:52 GMT -5
Regarding the "authorized" versus "unauthorized" comments by Walsh -- to me they seem like spin. I have a bit of insight into this as I approached Westerberg in early 2005 with the idea for an oral history (after discussing it at length with a friend who co-wrote "Please Kill Me"). It was clear that Paul wanted no part in such a project.
Anyway, I heard Jim was doing an oral history about a year later -- and heard neither Paul nor Tommy were being interviewed for it. First I read Walsh say that Paul told him an unauthorized book would sell better! Why would anyone possibly believe such nonsense? (Did Paul also tell him it would sell better with very few photos?) Now there's the old, "I wouldn't want to jeopardize our friendship"....
I think it's a fine book -- a bit fawning, sure, but what can you do? I'd like to read a book about the Replacements, placing them in the context of American music -- tracing the roots from Robert Johnson, Blind Lemon Jefferson, Lightnin Hopkins, Jimmy Reed --- up through a pudgy high school kid in Hibbing, MN banging on a piano and hollering at his high school talent show. Place 'em in the pantheon of crazy-ass rock-and-roll, like Jimmy Donley (read his hard-to-find bio, "Born To Be a Loser"), Jerry Lee Lewis, Johnny Ace -- Follow the river and it leads to the sea. There's a direct connection. And also, I think Paul's career is more interesting than a hundred get drunk, play a show, get in the van and drive to the next city stories.
All that grumbling aside, I am reading/enjoying the book, even if I've read many of the quotes a few times before in other publications....
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Post by nowwesayitoutloud on Oct 29, 2007 22:33:25 GMT -5
tmcgovern, those are some good ideas. would you be willing to write that roots book you describe? cuz I'd sure be willing to buy it.
as for oral history, it might be a misnomer for walsh's book. some of it's oral, a bit of it's email, a lot of it's the second-hand oral of old interviews. I found it kind of confusing that many entries begin with a writer's name in bold but the entry is really there to carry a quote from a Replacement.
I do appreciate the assembly and sequencing work that went into the book however. For some reason I read the introduction last and I found that chapter, where Walsh gave himself license to pull quotes from throughout the Mats career, to be particularly strong.
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cford
Star Scout
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Post by cford on Oct 30, 2007 8:25:10 GMT -5
I think it's a fine book -- a bit fawning, sure, but what can you do? I'd like to read a book about the Replacements, placing them in the context of American music -- tracing the roots from Robert Johnson, Blind Lemon Jefferson, Lightnin Hopkins, Jimmy Reed --- up through a pudgy high school kid in Hibbing, MN banging on a piano and hollering at his high school talent show. Place 'em in the pantheon of crazy-ass rock-and-roll, like Jimmy Donley (read his hard-to-find bio, "Born To Be a Loser"), Jerry Lee Lewis, Johnny Ace -- Follow the river and it leads to the sea. There's a direct connection. And also, I think Paul's career is more interesting than a hundred get drunk, play a show, get in the van and drive to the next city stories. All that grumbling aside, I am reading/enjoying the book, even if I've read many of the quotes a few times before in other publications.... That is pretty much my conclusion about the book, too. I read it and enjoyed it, but it is not really what I was hoping for. I thought the "oral history" was sort of a lazy approach. After all we have been reading these same basic quotes since day one, in one form or another. I think there is an interesting narrative that could be written on the Replacements career -- but, it has not been done yet. CF
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Post by Placemat on Oct 30, 2007 9:27:42 GMT -5
I think it's a fine book -- a bit fawning, sure, but what can you do? I'd like to read a book about the Replacements, placing them in the context of American music -- tracing the roots from Robert Johnson, Blind Lemon Jefferson, Lightnin Hopkins, Jimmy Reed --- up through a pudgy high school kid in Hibbing, MN banging on a piano and hollering at his high school talent show. Place 'em in the pantheon of crazy-ass rock-and-roll, like Jimmy Donley (read his hard-to-find bio, "Born To Be a Loser"), Jerry Lee Lewis, Johnny Ace -- Follow the river and it leads to the sea. There's a direct connection. And also, I think Paul's career is more interesting than a hundred get drunk, play a show, get in the van and drive to the next city stories. All that grumbling aside, I am reading/enjoying the book, even if I've read many of the quotes a few times before in other publications.... That is pretty much my conclusion about the book, too. I read it and enjoyed it, but it is not really what I was hoping for. I thought the "oral history" was sort of a lazy approach. After all we have been reading these same basic quotes since day one, in one form or another. I think there is an interesting narrative that could be written on the Replacements career -- but, it has not been done yet. CF My sentiments as well.
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Post by kgp on Oct 30, 2007 12:26:51 GMT -5
I do appreciate the assembly and sequencing work that went into the book however. For some reason I read the introduction last and I found that chapter, where Walsh gave himself license to pull quotes from throughout the Mats career, to be particularly strong. Oddly enough, I did too. I do think Walsh was "too close to the action" so to speak. He'd never be able to write a completely objective book. I don't know if anyone would. I like the idea of Azzerad (sp?) expanding on his Replacements chapter in Our Band Could be Your Life, but he follows too much of a standard template, and I don't know if it would lend itself well to telling the "Replacements story." That is pretty much my conclusion about the book, too. I read it and enjoyed it, but it is not really what I was hoping for. I thought the "oral history" was sort of a lazy approach. After all we have been reading these same basic quotes since day one, in one form or another. I think there is an interesting narrative that could be written on the Replacements career -- but, it has not been done yet. CF Agreed.
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Post by Stegman on Oct 30, 2007 15:04:19 GMT -5
as for oral history, it might be a misnomer for walsh's book. some of it's oral, a bit of it's email, a lot of it's the second-hand oral Second-hand oral? Ewwwww...
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Miss E.
Dances With Posts
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Post by Miss E. on Oct 31, 2007 12:51:53 GMT -5
A nice little surprise arrived at my front door this afternoon - a comp of the book! Besides looking for my name in the acknowledgments (which felt a bit like Steve Martin in The Jerk), I paged through it and read a few quotes. I have to say it looks great, and features some fantastic pics. I got a review copy today, I've flipped through and the pictures are great. He's got Paul's 8th grade school picture in there and oh my, it's adorable. The Westerbergian hair was already going strong at age 13! those two pix alone are worth the price of the book! so i got my copy yesterday and like hudson99, had my own steven martin/the jerk moment. i didn't know my quote had been used! i got a little goofy at the office and made everyone look at it. of course, they all went - "er, the replacements? wuh?" but they all think i'm somebody now.
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Post by FreeRider on Oct 31, 2007 13:32:42 GMT -5
I got a review copy today, I've flipped through and the pictures are great. He's got Paul's 8th grade school picture in there and oh my, it's adorable. The Westerbergian hair was already going strong at age 13! those two pix alone are worth the price of the book! Speaking of pics, I came across this one I hadn't seen (sorry, I know this is a tangent---I'm good at veering off topic):
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Post by Kathy on Oct 31, 2007 14:12:26 GMT -5
^^ What the heck? Where did that come from or is that some ultra clever photoshopping jobber?
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Post by FreeRider on Oct 31, 2007 14:18:55 GMT -5
^^ What the heck? Where did that come from or is that some ultra clever photoshopping jobber? As far as I know, no, no photoshopping. I found it over at TheSkyway site. Supposedly taken before the Louisville show in '05.
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Post by kgp on Nov 1, 2007 11:34:23 GMT -5
^^ What the heck? Where did that come from or is that some ultra clever photoshopping jobber? I was running down a list of all the guys, other than Paul, who can rock a pair of bright red pants, thinking that was Paul's head on someone else's body. (Note to pz: photoshop Paul's head on the body of Santa Claus.) Seriously, thanks for posting that pic. I love seeing Paul acting kind of goofy/tourist-y. I usually think of him when he's not onstage, holed up in hotel being dark and brooding.
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Post by FreeRider on Nov 1, 2007 12:11:20 GMT -5
^^ What the heck? Where did that come from or is that some ultra clever photoshopping jobber? I was running down a list of all the guys, other than Paul, who can rock a pair of bright red pants, thinking that was Paul's head on someone else's body. (Note to pz: photoshop Paul's head on the body of Santa Claus.) Seriously, thanks for posting that pic. I love seeing Paul acting kind of goofy/tourist-y. I usually think of him when he's not onstage, holed up in hotel being dark and brooding. Hmm. yeah, you know, I'm not sure what to think as to his life offstage. And really, that's because I don't know him. I always kinda figured that he was prone to a certain melancholia, to being contemplative aobut things. We all get in those moods nowand then. But I don't usually think of him as being alone and brooding by himself. And if he's alone, then he's comfortable and peaceful with doing that. Not in an anti-social, forlorn, way. Just simply a way for him to re-charge his batteries. I guess my impressions are that he's a private person, to balance out his public self, and that he's doing exactly what he wants to do offstage. and I think that freedom has to make him happy. One more (old) pic of him being goofy:
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