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Post by torethatbridgeout on Feb 26, 2004 1:54:38 GMT -5
name a song as evidence whichever way ...
Most often he's called a faithful friend to the fairer sex, but I recall a reviewer at the time, I'm thinking Robert Christgau in the Village Voice, being mildly disturbed by a whiff of mysogyny in "Waitress in the Sky."
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Post by A Regular on Feb 26, 2004 8:37:06 GMT -5
I think his songs are usually pretty empathetic towards woman and some of their "issues", but for whatever reason, I suspect he is less warm and fuzzy in "real life".
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duckfoot
Star Scout
I'm listening to the f*cking song!
Posts: 607
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Post by duckfoot on Feb 26, 2004 8:52:22 GMT -5
I believe he was making fun of one of his sister's in "Waitress in The Sky". She was a stewardess. A little brother v. sister one upmanship.
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Post by Caroline on Feb 26, 2004 16:35:04 GMT -5
I think his songs are usually pretty empathetic towards woman and some of their "issues", but for whatever reason, I suspect he is less warm and fuzzy in "real life". In other words, a regular guy. He is both romantic and cynic - perhaps leaning more towards the cynic.
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Doug
First Class Scout
Posts: 157
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Post by Doug on Feb 26, 2004 21:08:48 GMT -5
Bit of both. Without doing any research and with my questionable memory, there've been a few questionables, especially regarding talking too much. Down Love, A Few Minutes of Silence, Silent Film Star. (Someone I Once Knew?) I'm pretty sure there are others. But he's also got what I think is a deserved reputation for sensitivity to women. I think he just likes quiet and being alone, which I think most of us can relate to. And has a developed understanding of the differences between men and women.
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Post by torethatbridgeout on Feb 27, 2004 0:11:04 GMT -5
I hadn't voted yet, so I tried the last one and it worked, so your vote is registered, Jenin5.
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Post by davestell on Feb 27, 2004 20:34:27 GMT -5
Hi to everyone, just signed up.
Wanted to say about how paul appears to me on this. To me, the big reason I admire paul hugely is his love and kindness towards women which for me is clearly implanted in a huge amount of his songs. I have just decided, because I'm on a paid internet connection, I'll write, upstairs, a little more on this actually as I used to try it all the time, and now I'm a littel older, maybe I'll do better if I dont try too hard.
I'll post back later thanks Dave
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Post by torethatbridgeout on Feb 28, 2004 1:05:12 GMT -5
his love and kindness towards women which for me is clearly implanted in a huge amount those opinions ... are those yours? kidding, say can you please explain your name, davestell?
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Post by davestell on Feb 28, 2004 19:54:08 GMT -5
I can indeed say my name – (I don’t have a clue what inspired it) My name is dave however, I’m 22 from Ireland, howdy star scout
I wrote some word salad last night- gee, f that- I have to print it now too. This morning, I woke and thought, sweet, glad I did’nt write too much crap on that paul westerberg site last night. Tomorrow morn, I’ll go, bollox, I wrote on that site last night.
Here it is – clean and un-edited (bar a spell check that took a half hour- so just forgive any sentences that make no sense whatsoever)
* A quite wonderful experience, confirmation of how I felt (or so it seemed) was when I put in replacements all for nothing discs to pc- seing videos etc. A summers night I'll never forget. Paul has reached into my time and said “While you watch the disaster (I think of how rotten, and more noteably thick, the world has got thru media to women in the last ten yrs alone) I'll give you some home movies we made and well forget the rest for a while ,especially seing as were gonna have to spend our whole lives shovelling- starting tomorrow) – sorry a bit dramatic
In the replacements, Paul seemed to be one of those people who wanted to make a better world for his children (the future generations) He seemed to want to make it clear he was not only not a part, but also a fighter against what he saw as an erosion process taking place in his time.
Paul does not seem like your average guy to me as a listener. He seems like a guy who is just a handful of guys and girls. It's clear some girls see something hauntingly kind about him too. I see the odd message that just says 'thanks' (signed by a girl) I think if I were a girl, thats what word I'd choose to to write to Paul too. As a guy, its also the word though yeh. Thanks says it best.
Things convince me paul has been a sensitive guy to women indeed, even rather a constant worker for some men and women, looking to go unnoticed.
General, grocely incomplete list of some simple things..I could connect either to the girl thing, or something similar
1.telling girls to wear guitars (left of the dial) while theres often a subtle sniffing of the nose with some guys
2.video 'achin to be' casting an all so real girl. (have no idea who she was to paul/mats) but it was a fine protest, rather than a hottie.
3.'kick your door down' comes accross as a story of a teen outside a typical Johnny's door, looking for some trouble
4.Johnny's gonna die (theres one sure way Johnny, you can leave your mark) -man sluts in my city?
5.'Raised in the city' (she gets rubber in all four gears) - not quite related to a sensitivity towards women you might say more of an observation, black comedy. (Brian wilson said something similar actually, only in a different context- I forget the famous beach boys song it's on, only recalling a husker du line -or a line husker du had changed slightly for one of their own songs also featuring in this beach boys track, or one very close by on the album) - must go and find the tape.
6.'Skyway' just generally not really feeling in a position to collide, but having that ability we all have to an extent- almost feeling psychic contact with song subject? (That’s just a big guess- kind of stupid and confusing actually- forget that)……shit, you got me, I read over it, but did’nt change anything
7.Try and free a slave of ignorance, try and teach a whore about romance (answering machine) Again, not exactly easy to see as a compliment to girls you could say (rather difficult to explain) It's more of a song to guys? trying to get through to his fellow man, saying this is what you've got when you stop? –sucker Always wonder if the slave is the girl or the guy, as paul undoubtedly was caring in equal doses towards both sexes (he was a good example of someone who genuinely saw great light in equality I think)
Shit, there’s tons more I'm sure, in his writing, forgetting the metaphors, and then the haunting qualities he had in his voice (that otherwise, a passer by might not think is that exceptional) A bit like Joey ramone really (not that I otherwise compare the two). My mum always used to say 'He doesn’t have an especially good voice' when I'd play any ramones but with that bands songs where Joey repeats the same line, you spend some time thinking the track is rubbish before you locate the masterly hidden/invisible insert of emotion.
Lastly, I'd just say, I'm sure I sound a bit rude, or even naive writing all this. It's what the forums for- sharing thoughts, but at the end I have decided (I used to try and write replacements articles a lot a few yrs back) that its comfortingly impossible to define Paul’s art- this stands for the fact that’s it's so multi-diversional. It branches off everywhere. Also, I don't just think just replacements, but am simply not quick to hurry myself through all else he's done (although I've heard and find equally interesting his solo stuff I pace it as I can't discover any artists who I relate to like him, and that’s no lie (Although I'd love to discover in a few years I'm being negative and like all kinds of songwriters) The years just tick on.
Great site by the way (Kathy and contribution!) Glad to be a member Thanks
(and my name again, yeh, what the f, well spotted star scout)
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Post by davestell on Feb 28, 2004 19:58:51 GMT -5
Just realised that star scout is your rating, not name, I'm tenderfoot, I get it yeh. Sorry about that. Also realised how unreasonably long that message is Sorry about that too.
Dave
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Post by FeelinLike100Bucks on Feb 28, 2004 20:47:10 GMT -5
Dave,
Congrats- you just surpassed Swinginparty for the longest post ever on this board and you did it in your 2nd post.
I'm not really sure about much of what you said, but anybody who listens to the Ramones with his "mum" is cool with me.
Welcome.
p.s. (you're probably going to have to endure a bit of hazing from some of the regulars, but keep your chin up, it's all in good fun)
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Post by §winginparty™ on Feb 28, 2004 20:59:42 GMT -5
Because you broke my record.... Do they speak English in Ireland? (part of the good-natured hazing $100 mentioned!)
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Post by torethatbridgeout on Feb 28, 2004 23:12:41 GMT -5
ontopic: I'm glad to hear that waitress is just some sibling teasing
offtopic: dave, it was the stell part of your name i was curious about
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Post by ElegantMule on Feb 29, 2004 2:28:10 GMT -5
I have a question about #4 but I have no idea how to go about wording it.
Wasn't Johnny's Gonna Die about J. Thunders?
Anyway, I bet PW is a regular guy because much of the music he loves is misogynistic (The Faces, anyone?) but yet he got messed up in the punk scene at a time when chicks were starting to come into their own.
That and any guy has to get his head out of his ass - eventually - if he ever wants to get laid.
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Post by torethatbridgeout on Feb 29, 2004 8:35:49 GMT -5
most excellent points, ElevatorMusic, amd thanks for the correct spelling of misogynistic. Award for creative spelling to davestell: "grocely" for "grossly." Yes, JGD was about J. Thunders ... I'm not at all clear what davestell's point was there.
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Post by kgp on Feb 29, 2004 18:04:20 GMT -5
I was going to say that deep down he is probably a regular guy who lays on the couch watching the game while yellling, "Hey honey make me another sandwitch", but dave's heartfelt post makes me sound like a real schmo. ;D
The last few months of my grandma's life when I used to make her meals, clean her house etc... I brought over several cds to play to pass the time. She really liked Pleased To Meet me, especially "I.O.U" and "Skyway".
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Post by A Regular on Feb 29, 2004 18:14:18 GMT -5
The last few months of my grandma's life when I used to make her meals, clean her house etc... I brought over several cds to play to pass the time. She really liked Pleased To Meet me, especially "I.O.U" and "Skyway". I love the idea of being later in life, and humming I.O.U. (nothing). Sounds like a fun grannie.
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Post by kgp on Feb 29, 2004 19:14:00 GMT -5
I love the idea of being later in life, and humming I.O.U. (nothing). Sounds like a fun grannie. Yes she was. Not really a fan of Chris's drumming, tho.
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Post by davestell on Feb 29, 2004 19:58:53 GMT -5
OFF TOPIC (sorry bout that message swingin, did’nt mean to steal any records) bad start indeed Thanks for the welcome- the good natured hazing- and message by 100-+ toreoutthatbridge (the stell is forever a mystery toreout) I spilled the beans on my listening to the ramones with my mum yeh (it was pretty good) That was a while back, unfortunately shes maybe past it now (however nasty that may sound) – besides from the fact that shes lost her hearing shes saying all kinds of mad things each time I visit I will heed your kind words 100 – I feel the new boy vibe alongside the friendly atmosphere! I suppose for some of you, it’s a job to guard the board in that sense, and I appreciate -as even I have been that very asshole himself :'(in the past believe it or not (who needs to be driven away etc) – just fortunately not on this site – It’s usually peoples sites who I know in person actually ;D- makes it worse. Cheers for the welcome!
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Post by davestell on Feb 29, 2004 20:09:33 GMT -5
OFF TOPIC
Gee, I must be messing up this board by now - I'm not that sure on how it works yet Certainly managed to miss several messages from other people anyway. Thanks to everyone.
(mats with the gran -classic) and the 100 quote on my ramones bit - that was great
"I'm not really sure about much of what you said, but anybody who listens to the Ramones with his "mum" is cool with me. " - classic
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