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Post by anarkissed on Nov 21, 2018 20:41:44 GMT -5
I've said this before...And been wrong...But this is it from him, isn't it? He's never going to do an "actual album"...There's no way he's gonna tour...He's through writing songs, huh? I'm o.k. with the searching through the archives phase, but I think he hates that shit...He has earned his retirement...Fuck, I tried that for, about, nine months, and it was awesome...But I needed money...I don't think he does (Paul, if you do, hit me up...I ain't so poor I can't pitch in a $20...That's the least I owe)...But as an active musician recording, releasing, playing live, even overseeing reissues, I think he's done...It was an awesome ride, man...Fuck us...Relax...Your legacy is secured...
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Post by dee on Nov 21, 2018 22:58:30 GMT -5
Sounds like the kind of talk going around after Suicaine Gratifaction when PW didn't tour for it and people were pretty divided about that album.
Then came the in stores followed by Mono,Stereo,Come Feel Me Tremble(DVD & album),Dead Man Shake,Folker,Open Season,49:00,PW & the Ghost Gloves Cat Wing Joy Boys,and other self released material. Along with two more tours,many interviews with PW sharing a lot of himself and the tagline of "They can't miss you if you don't go away" in regards to his reputation of retiring to his basement and being called the J.D. Salinger of rock and roll.All of that in seven years.2002-2009.
His narrative is always intact and his albums are all pretty distinct from one to the next.I wouldn't rule out another run.
That said,age is creeping in and the times we live in might seem daunting to a creative spokesman this late in the game.The elder statesman card has been played.He's always seemed to capture the mind state of a continuation of expression against the backdrop of "real life".Is whatever he was an elder statesman of,does it even exist anymore? Well,we're still here.
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Post by raccoon on Nov 22, 2018 8:04:35 GMT -5
I've said this before...And been wrong...But this is it from him, isn't it? He's never going to do an "actual album"...There's no way he's gonna tour...He's through writing songs I'll take this bet. Anyone want to wager? The man has it in his veins. He'll come around sooner rather than later. Just playing possum for now. Meanwhile, I am thinking of turkey. Happy Thanksgiving all !!!!
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Post by curmudgeonman on Nov 22, 2018 23:13:24 GMT -5
I don't think he's "done", but I do acknowledge that he's not going to put out any work any time soon.
As I've posted elsewhere, IMO, Westerberg is a lazy person. It seems he has always worked a project, then taken an extended sabbatical. His peers, like Bob Mould and John Doe work hard, they seem to always have something going on to make a good living. I highly doubt Westerberg has earned enough to retire on, I don't think his reunion tour netted him millions of dollars. The REM guys, sure, I can see them banking away enough to retire on. We tend to forget that he is a niche artist, who doesn't seem to own a production company or any other business, doesn't tour annually, and hell, maybe didn't really invest in anything like a 401k, who knows?. His recordings tend to sell poorly and I can't believe he can retire on royalties alone.
I think eventually, he will start to run out of funds and need another project to earn. His last money-making venture was the reunion tour and that ended over 3 years ago. And like a lot of aging rockers already know, selling new recordings is a tough way to earn, thus the need to tour. Is he capable of recording a new album of songs, and then tour behind it? I think so, but I don't know whether he is willing. And he's got some college tuition payments to make...
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Post by FreeRider on Nov 23, 2018 10:06:26 GMT -5
I agree with all the above. The man is predictably unpredictable. But if i were to divine what's going on? I think he's done with the touring stuff. It's just not in his blood anymore to do that stuff anymore after having spent a big chunk of his earlier life in the trenches and living out of a suitcase.
As for the songwriting? I think, as I mentioned in the Paul's peak thread, that he'll continue to write and record---for himself. Maybe he'll have some material he'll throw out to us fans, but I think it's therapy for him and it's just what he does. Michael Bland posted here on the Folker tour (which was great of him to interact with the fans) said that Paul hears music all the time.
And that is a rare thing. I've heard Neil Young, Carly Simon, Miles Davis say the same thing. Neil said that he has to get it out of him, song ideas popping up all the time---and he says he has to do something with and record so he can maintain being "regular". (Weird analogy from Neil, comparing it to his bowel movements, but whatever...). Miles Davis says everything he hears sounds like music to him. Whether it's a kid bouncing a basketball up the street, he hears a rhythm, or a taxi car horn, he hears it as music. Carly said the same thing about hearing music, sounds, ideas in her head too.
As for royalties, I think he's gotten some pretty good paychecks for having Glen Campbell do two of his songs. I dunno if he still gets a cut from the sales of Glen Campbell's last CD as part of mechanical royalties. He gets the songwriting royalties or the publishing stuff, but I have no idea what the percentage is and if it's tied into Campbell's sales. He'll get performance royalties if country radio plays those Campbell songs on the air. The reunion tour gigs, getting big paycheck from the Coachella folks. I would hope that he's banked it and invested some of it. I know he's never been big on the bean counting in his younger years, but I would hope as he's now on the cusp of 60, he's smarter about his money.
I am like one of three people in my section of the office that came in to work. Nothing is getting done, not even gonna bother to try and get anything done and am certainly not looking to get anything done. Except hit the gym (free for me, it's our office gym) and get lunch! Hope everyone had a nice Thanksgiving/Indigenous People's Day...
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Post by jimmyrock on Nov 25, 2018 15:00:21 GMT -5
yes, he is done. he was done the minute he decided to abandon Brendan O'Brien on the Eventually album.
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Post by curmudgeonman on Nov 25, 2018 16:54:18 GMT -5
As for the songwriting? I think, as I mentioned in the Paul's peak thread, that he'll continue to write and record---for himself. Maybe he'll have some material he'll throw out to us fans, but I think it's therapy for him and it's just what he does. Michael Bland posted here on the Folker tour (which was great of him to interact with the fans) said that Paul hears music all the time. I will go further and say that Westerberg has been recording for "himself" for quite awhile. I think the last time he recorded for "others" was the Open Season soundtrack, a reasonably well produced effort that very may be his best selling "solo" record; it did almost reach the top 10 Billboard charts in 2006. And from what I remember, he was well paid for it by the film producers, not counting royalties. But living on royalties alone may not be possible in a modern rock 'n' roll world. Keith Richards in his book stated that the Stones do not make money in royalties, it barely pays the overhead. And he is not the only well known "elder" musical artist to state this. And we're talking about The Rolling Stones, whose back catalog rivals the Beatles and Elvis Presley. I remember an interview with Nick Lowe, whose song What's So Funny 'Bout Peace Love and Understanding was covered in The Bodyguard movie, the best selling soundtrack in history (17 million units). Lowe made money through songwriting royalties, but not millions; in fact he spent it all financing a later club tour with a full band. As a small business owner, I sometimes wonder how an artist like Westerberg makes it in life. His revenue streams seem to be limited to recording and touring. I can't imagine soundtracks or theater work would be in his future. He's recently divorced, has a kid in college, and is laying pretty low in an industry that kinda requires the opposite. I hope he owns a hardware store or something (a restaurant would be too Michael Stipe-ish). Sure he made money at Coachella, but 2nd tier bands in that festival make 50-150 grand per show, doesn't leave much after splitting it up, and paying management percentages, etc. Unfortunately, touring might be his only way of surviving in this industry, unless someone like Taylor Swift records a couple of his songs. Maybe re-invent himself, but that would be more difficult than just falling back onto the Mats. But I think R.E.M. re-uniting would be more of a possibility than Westerberg taking on a full band tour.
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Post by worldclassfad on Nov 25, 2018 19:44:48 GMT -5
Maybe he is done, who knows. I just don't think he gives a shit, and I'm totally OK with that. He's given us MORE than enough these last 10 years. Replacements re-issues galore, new Replacements recordings, 2 years of a REPLACEMENTS REUNION complete with tour. Not to mention his Dry Wood Garage stuff, home recordings and especially The I Don't Cares. We all know he's got it in him yet, but if this is it from our dear Grandpaboy than that's fine with me. To be honest, I didn't think we'd ever hear from him again after the Ghost Glove Cat Wing Joy Boys.
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Post by dee on Nov 26, 2018 4:34:17 GMT -5
Take #1 It's selfish to expect anything.We project an awful lot onto him when the wheels aren't rolling.By some accounts he's recording all the time and has a sizeable back catalogue that has never been heard.If it's true,that's cool.It's like the song Debris by the faces,at what point do you see your idol as a person and when you do,don't be so quick to judge or pry.
Take #2 He has a fan base. We have expectations. He has made a career out of confounding expectations,the Replacements were built upon that premise.Then came Grandpaboy.This game of cat and mouse is why we still speculate.It's always been what this ride of being a fan of P.W. is all about.It's his game and weather or not he's in,it's always going to be this way as long as the music means something to us.
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Post by FreeRider on Nov 26, 2018 10:42:40 GMT -5
again, all good points and perspectives by everyone... Take #1 It's selfish to expect anything.We project an awful lot onto him when the wheels aren't rolling.By some accounts he's recording all the time and has a sizeable back catalogue that has never been heard.If it's true,that's cool.It's like the song Debris by the faces,at what point do you see your idol as a person and when you do,don't be so quick to judge or pry. Excellent point and one that I'm behind. The I Don't Cares CD came out in 2016, just 2 years ago. Paul must be chuckling and shaking his head, thinking, "I just gave you folks something and you're still begging for more?" I mean, doesn't it take a band an average of like 2-3 years to put out another album? This songwriting stuff is hard, it takes time. As a hobbyist and wannabe rock musician in my own head, I struggle with coming up with good musical ideas for my own songs. There is a lot that goes into it---many times, even when inspired, I'm sitting there with my guitar and my chord progression or riff I came up with and the 8 track is rolling....and I can't turn it into anything. It's a mystery how this shit is even done, where it comes from and how guys like Paul and Neil Young, Pete Townshend can be so prolific. Then you get guys like Paul Simon and Warren Zevon who've been on the record as saying it's painful for them to get going, they really struggle too with writing stuff! For all my criticisms of Paul, I am still grateful for anything that he releases. The good and the bad. And yes, the man has a life as well outside of music---let him live it and attend to the daily mundane tasks we all go through.
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Jer
Beagle Scout
Posts: 1,182
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Post by Jer on Nov 26, 2018 12:46:04 GMT -5
It's perfectly fine to wonder/question what he's up to and long for more/better output. It's not like we're setting up tents in his yard or anything. Fans of artists will always debate output (quantity, quality, etc) and it's perfectly normal (and fun), not selfish. Artists know the drill, and compared to most, Paul gets off pretty easy because there aren't all that many of us and he stays pretty detached. He certainly deserves his personal space, but questioning why we don't have new music and what he's got left in the tank isn't a violation of that. And I can make the argument that while you might not be able to complain about quantity of releases, you could complain about the quality and type of output. The I Don't Cares was a great surprise, but it's right there with everything else he's done in the last several years that, while better than nothing, doesn't exactly fulfill the need to get music of the caliber that he's capable of for a lot of us. The tour was fun (for us, not him) and the re-releases were ok if you're looking for that sixth copy of Pleased to Meet Me, but again, it's not filling any holes for me. The Maxwell's release was the exception - more along the lines of what I'd like to see from the past - super high quality, officially released, killer content. Let's not forget about the books too, though not really official Replacements releases. A live DVD box set would be cool to see next (but don't hold your breath for the Midway show). More than anything I'd just like a real album. Asking for a tour would be a lot, knowing how he loathes touring, but it's not too much to look for a legitimate release from one of the best songwriters of his generation. I expect he does ok with his royalties. I don't know, but I would guess that he can pay the bills, but lives pretty modestly. The tour was probably a nice payday, but not really something to live off for years to come. He probably gets regular checks for Singles and Open Season, and smaller checks from other movies and his own publishing (solo, mats, Campbell, etc). It is surprising he doesn't cash in more, maybe odd that he doesn't have to, but cheers to him for doing it his way...but we can still bitch about it and long for some new and different stuff.
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Post by anarkissed on Nov 26, 2018 22:00:09 GMT -5
Just for the record, I made it clear, off the top, that I in no way thought Paul owed anybody anything, and that I was grateful for everything he's done, and I was comfortable with that and wished Godspeed upon whatever life decisions he made hereafter...I did, didn't I? I'm not sure; I've started drinking again...But this seemed to turn into that sorta debate about our expectations and his responsibility towards them...I was just idly speculating about what he might do from now on...And I will resolutely stand by two things: He's never playing live again in any formal setting, and he is never doing the "proper album in a real studio with a real producer and a real drummer and a metronome"...Not saying he should or should not; just saying it's not gonna happen...Heh...Made you post!
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Post by dee on Nov 27, 2018 1:32:57 GMT -5
It's kind of funny that the longer he's away,in peoples minds,he becomes more fragile and incapable or incompetent,and when he comes back he's always the same talented and funny and irreverent guy he's always been.
I could see Paul doing a 3 night hometown stand again like he's done in the past. Why the hell not?
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Post by Veets on Nov 27, 2018 8:55:15 GMT -5
I'd love to see an Act II from him, where he shows some of his art. I wonder whether he's sitting on a pile of unreleased stuff, or if he only puts things together for album covers.
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Post by FreeRider on Nov 27, 2018 12:44:34 GMT -5
I'm not sure either how long his money lasts from royalties and the reunion tour payouts. But as Jer noted, he lives modestly. So he doesn't need the mass infusion of cash like the Stones do to simply maintain all their properties and mansions, and pay off their staff of employees, etc... I'd think he's okay and would hope that he's got his money socked away somewhere, safely invested in something (for what that's worth in these uncertain times). But if he ripped through like $100,000 already, I wonder what kind of expenses he's got (apart from child support and college tuition stuff and heating costs for those brutal winters) where he'd burn right thru that in a few years. I don't know what the cost of living is like in the Minne area but it can't be quite as high as something like Chicago or NYC, DC, etc... And I have always thought it would be possible for Paul to do a 3 night gig somewhere. Nothing long term, but just to go out and have some fun for a few nights. But even Paul says he's done : www.youtube.com/watch?v=51mjsxOa-40
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nyc1lkg
First Class Scout
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Post by nyc1lkg on Nov 27, 2018 20:21:12 GMT -5
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Post by FreeRider on Nov 29, 2018 11:10:10 GMT -5
It's interesting to see it from the artist's perspective....ran across this on CNN.com with Paul Simon, I just saw him in September on his farewell tour. I'm sure that Simon's thoughts mirror many other artists as well in terms of, "are they done?" And I'm thinking that maybe some of these thoughts are ones that ol' Westy has had as well. We're speculating on what's up with Paul and have our own wishes and desires as fans versus what Paul's desires are as the artist, and I'm wondering how much he would agree with Simon Some excerpts: "I'm not physically tired; I'm mentally tired in a way that I don't know how to explain exactly."
It shouldn't be that surprising. At 77, Simon has a strong claim to be America's greatest living songwriter, with an award-winning career spanning seven decades --
But now, Simon has decided to stop. It's not quite retirement, but it comes close. .... But as he explained to Christiane Amanpour for her show on CNN International and PBS, this isn't a final goodbye.
"I don't intend for it to be my last performance," he said at his office in New York -- just his last tour.
"I'd like to do it for my own pleasure, in concert halls that have prestige sound and with perhaps different musicians that I admire, and play a repertoire that is different from what I've been playing."
With his most recent and possibly last album, "In the Blue Light," he has dusted off some of his back catalog, rearranging and revising some of his favorite songs. "These are songs that I thought were well written -- good songs that were overlooked, or people didn't notice them when I put them out," he said.
If this indeed proves to be his last album, Simon considers that very much his own choice.
"It's not like I couldn't do another album now at the same qualitative level as I've done the last two or three albums -- which I think are as good as I can do, as I've ever been. I think I could do that, but I'm not sure that's the most interesting choice for me."
Still, he acknowledges that even if he wants to let go of songwriting, songwriting may not let go of him: "I can't help but think music. It seems it's always there. I wake up with it."
At its best, songwriting for Simon comes close to a mystical experience. When he finished writing "Bridge over Troubled Water," he recalled, he had to admit to himself: "'That's better than I usually do.'"
"Graceland," he said, also fell into that category, "where you feel as if you are a conduit and the song is coming through you. You're shaping it, but you're absolutely surprised at what's happening, and you don't know why, and you don't know where it comes from.
"But I recognize that that happens sometimes, and it's led me to be a more spiritual person -- because of the mystery of it." He has learned to accept that process for what it is.
"I'm holding back from going into solving these musical thoughts, as if they were puzzles that needed to be solved. "Now I say, 'No, don't solve it that way. Just leave it alone. Let's just see what happens.' "
"I don't believe in legacy," he told Amanpour. "I don't believe that there's any importance to it. "I've already left a great deal of my thinking. I just turned 77, so I've already left my thinking through these songs -- some of which are very, very well-known -- so it's good to stop and see what else will I think of. Or maybe I won't. Maybe I'll just take a rest." www.cnn.com/2018/11/14/entertainment/paul-simon-amanpour/index.html
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Post by brianlux on Nov 29, 2018 22:00:23 GMT -5
First thought that came to my mind: The song "Done, Done, Done" from "The I Don't Cares" CD.
Second thought that came to my mind: No way, he ain't done.
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exit0
Tenderfoot
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Post by exit0 on Nov 30, 2018 13:06:35 GMT -5
I heard he's hanging out with Chris and painting.
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Post by thematsarealive on Dec 5, 2018 21:01:43 GMT -5
I've said this before...And been wrong...But this is it from him, isn't it? He's never going to do an "actual album"...There's no way he's gonna tour...He's through writing songs, huh? I'm o.k. with the searching through the archives phase, but I think he hates that shit...He has earned his retirement...Fuck, I tried that for, about, nine months, and it was awesome...But I needed money...I don't think he does (Paul, if you do, hit me up...I ain't so poor I can't pitch in a $20...That's the least I owe)...But as an active musician recording, releasing, playing live, even overseeing reissues, I think he's done...It was an awesome ride, man...Fuck us...Relax...Your legacy is secured... The I Don't Cares album came out in 2015. I'll bet money he'll put out another album. I think that's more likely than you starting to post in actual grammatical sentences with a point instead of rambling "..."
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