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Post by wecantgetanybetter on Jul 31, 2011 12:21:52 GMT -5
This New York Times article talks about how some phrases are much more common in literature or fiction than in everyday speech, and highlights the phrase "bolt upright." "Bolt Upright" stands out in "Someone I Once Knew"--kind of like "Love Untold" or "what our lips must quell," very literary-sounding phrases PW deploys in some of his songs. It's definitely a mark of his artistic, intelligent, sophisticated song-writer side, but it's undercut with a healthy mix of folkier sayings--kind of like the albums usually zig-zag between loud/quiet, silly/serious, one genre and another. |
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Post by balbina on Dec 30, 2012 21:48:06 GMT -5
I have a serious question and would like a serious answer if anyone has one. Does anyone ever notice a touch of misogyny in PW's lyrics? I'm thinking of the "keep that pretty little trap shut" line in Silent Film Star or all of Waitress In The Sky. Before anyone gets upset with me I like PW's music and i don't like political correctness either. Just wondering what other folks are thinking.
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Post by anarkissed on Dec 30, 2012 22:02:39 GMT -5
Does anyone ever notice a touch of misogyny in PW's lyrics? In a word, no...I think he's an equal opportunist when it cames to slamming less than desirable character qualities in others, without regard to gender...You could find numerous barbs directed towards males in his lyrics...Sometimes, I think it's just a matter of what works better..."Waitress in the Sky", to me, was always just about the irritation anyone can feel by being mistreated by a service worker, any worker, who seems to affect a sort of superior attitude by virtue of their position within a customer/customer service relationship...They think they're better than you, because you need something from them. They hate their job, they resent having to wait on you,they're taking it out on you, and you're thinking: "Yeah, but you actually have a crappier job than I do"...I guess it could have been a male flight attendant, but "Waiter in the Sky" just doesn't sound as good. I suppose you could make a better case with "Silent Film Star", because I guess he is saying this woman's worth lies more in her appearance than anything she might have to say, but "keep that pretty little trap shut" - I always really liked that line. Maybe I'm not as enlightened as I thought I was...I confess I've had similar thoughts before. I think it's as much of a comment on the superficiality of this particular character's appeal (i.e., "you oughtta be a 'silent' film star") as it is just telling her to shut up... |
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Post by FreeRider on Dec 30, 2012 23:43:04 GMT -5
while on face value 'Waitress' might come off as a little mean, wasn't the song based on one of his sisters being a flight attendant and kind of being a jab at her for coming across as high and mighty?
As for 'Silent', aren't there some people who are elevated to lots of media attention when they havent had any accomplishment? Paris Hilton? Kardashians? The Jersey Snore crew? I took the song as a jab against this celebrity obsessed culture we're in.
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Post by anarkissed on Dec 31, 2012 23:52:29 GMT -5
I always imagined Courtney Love when hearing "Silent Film Star"...Though, I have to say, she was pretty incredible in "The People Vs. Larry Flynt" and "Man In The Moon", and I really liked a lot of Hole...I think it was that "subtle as a battering ram" line...
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Post by raccoon on Jan 4, 2013 10:24:54 GMT -5
Back to the literary angle. I think Paul has read a lot more books than people might realize. He is still rock n' roll enough to say 'aint' of course but he has the blood of a true artist. Isn't it clear that Bob Dylan (and Jagger/Richards) is his songwriting hero?? He left the Johnny Thunders school of songwriting a long long time ago.
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Post by anarkissed on Jan 4, 2013 23:34:29 GMT -5
What's wrong with the Johnny Thunders school? I think "You Can't Put Your Arms Around A Memory" and "Born To Lose" are two of the greatest songs ever written...
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Squaw
Star Scout
You're the only one that you are screwin' when you put down what you don't understand~ Kristofferson
Posts: 544
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Post by Squaw on Jan 5, 2013 4:55:08 GMT -5
I have a serious question and would like a serious answer if anyone has one. Does anyone ever notice a touch of misogyny in PW's lyrics? I'm thinking of the "keep that pretty little trap shut" line in Silent Film Star or all of Waitress In The Sky. Before anyone gets upset with me I like PW's music and i don't like political correctness either. Just wondering what other folks are thinking. Balbina, I agree with anarkissed. No way, no how! He’s one of the last artists I would label as a misogynist. Paul is actually deemed to be extremely pro female, as most of his female fans will attest. He writes from the female perspective quite often. But as anarkissed mentioned, he will be critical or insulting toward either gender, just as you or I might be. He shoots from the hip – says what he thinks, and I don’t detect any hidden agenda, at least as far as woman hating, degrading, or oppressing is concerned. ( And if he's your groom, he promises not to leave the room, even if he has to vomit!) |
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Squaw
Star Scout
You're the only one that you are screwin' when you put down what you don't understand~ Kristofferson
Posts: 544
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Post by Squaw on Jan 5, 2013 5:00:21 GMT -5
Isn't it clear that Bob Dylan (and Jagger/Richards) is his songwriting hero?? Yep, crystal. |
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Squaw
Star Scout
You're the only one that you are screwin' when you put down what you don't understand~ Kristofferson
Posts: 544
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Post by Squaw on Jan 5, 2013 5:04:01 GMT -5
...I think it was that "subtle as a battering ram" line... One of my favorite lines, I grin every time I hear him sing it.  |
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Post by ClamsCasino on Jan 5, 2013 23:18:02 GMT -5
I always imagined Courtney Love when hearing "Silent Film Star"...Though, I have to say, she was pretty incredible in "The People Vs. Larry Flynt" and "Man In The Moon", and I really liked a lot of Hole...I think it was that "subtle as a battering ram" line... I thought Paul let slip in an interview that he wrote it about Winona Ryder? |
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Post by anarkissed on Jan 6, 2013 1:08:17 GMT -5
I always imagined Courtney Love when hearing "Silent Film Star"...Though, I have to say, she was pretty incredible in "The People Vs. Larry Flynt" and "Man In The Moon", and I really liked a lot of Hole...I think it was that "subtle as a battering ram" line... I thought Paul let slip in an interview that he wrote it about Winona Ryder? Heh...Really? That's great...I love her, though...Just saw her in a brief, but completely appropriate, and effectively devastating role in "Black Swan"...Yeah, no silence for her...Always kinda had a thing for those slightly unbalanced women, anyway...Usually much to my short-term intense gratification and longer-term serious psychological regret... |
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Post by FreeRider on Jan 6, 2013 11:04:42 GMT -5
I always imagined Courtney Love when hearing "Silent Film Star"...Though, I have to say, she was pretty incredible in "The People Vs. Larry Flynt" and "Man In The Moon", and I really liked a lot of Hole...I think it was that "subtle as a battering ram" line... I thought Paul let slip in an interview that he wrote it about Winona Ryder? cool! would love to find it somewhere so we can add it to the PW/Mats Articles database thread |
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Post by ClamsCasino on Jan 6, 2013 17:20:09 GMT -5
A Google search isn't turning up much apart from other people speculating that it's about Ryder. I'm probably wrong, but Ryder does seem like the obvious subject of that song. The only interview I could find where Paul talked about her is this one from the SF Chronicle: www.sfgate.com/music/popquiz/article/POP-QUIZ-Paul-Westerberg-Ex-Replacements-2844191.php"...I just have a low threshold for stupid people. Q: Speaking of which, did Winona Ryder steal anything from you when you were seeing her? A: Steal anything? My time." |
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Post by paulinetrouble on Jan 12, 2013 22:09:14 GMT -5
hahhaha. That was funny up there, that "speaking of which." hahhahahaha.
Yeah, PW always seemed smarter than the average bear in the literary department. I love when someone's vocabulary is extensive and evidences a deep understanding of those different little shades of meaning among words. In short, he had me at "disconcerted." ; )
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