Jer
Beagle Scout
Posts: 1,182
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Post by Jer on Jul 31, 2021 6:30:54 GMT -5
Glen Campbell’s Ghost On The Canvas re-entered the chart with 3,000 sold and now has 65,000 sold since debuting last fall. (this was from an article published in 2012),this 6 months after it's release. Let's say it doubled to 130,000, and let's say those mechanical royalties are 10 cents each, Westerberg walks away with $26K. Not very much. Let's even say the album in the last decade has gone gold, then he'd get roughly $100K, and maybe the airplay royalties would net him some more money, but really not a lot. It's a lot for 2 songs, but I'm sure the dvd sales for Open Season netted him a lot more and the netflix or disney+ streaming nets him a lot more royalties. Glen Campbell's goodbye, was a ghost on the canvas...great for a indie record, probably not so great for a major label and nowhere near Rhinestone Cowboy days...the number of streams on spotify for Ghost on the Canvas pails in comparison to Rhinestone Cowboy or Wichita Lineman. And even if Westerberg did pocket all the spotify money for those 2 songs, it wouldn't be much. Yes on all this. It was a decent record sales-wise by today's standards, ok by 2012 standards, but there's not a big pile of cash there, and Paul only wrote 2 of the songs - he didn't even play on it. I'm sure they paid him up front for the songs, and he saw some modest publishing income around the release. Streaming is next to nothing - artists get a small fraction of a penny per-play, and Glen would get a share of that too. If Paul makes $2k a year on streaming for his entire catalog I'd be a bit surprised and say he's doing well. It's a horrible model that favors the companies who rake in the cash and the consumer who listens for free (or pays a subscription) but not the artists who provide the product. It's also better for artists with younger audiences who embrace technology more and don't have physical copies of the music. Paul's song was the single, so he'd get publishing royalties from airplay, but radio doesn't have nearly the impact it did a few decades ago, and I doubt that record got played a ton anyway.
The Open Season thing was certainly a good payday, but modern residuals all depend on the deal he got. He may or may not get a piece of DVD, streaming, all that. Same with Friends, but less so, because it was just one (?) song. Who knows what those deals looked like.
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Post by FreeRider on Jul 31, 2021 20:34:02 GMT -5
good enough points---I have no idea how these royalty payments work or what the actual sales are. I'd have assumed that Campbell's posthumous sales, which spiked high, would include his latter works. But I guess it was mostly for his hits. I would've thought Paul might have made 6 figures....maybe he still can, but if it's spread out over time, bit by bit, well, that's not enough to live off of. And yes, I knew that streaming doesn't pay the artists shit unless it's like a million plays or something. Dave Lowery from Cracker and Camper Van Beethoven had filed a lawsuit against Spotify, claiming that they were ripping off the artists with such lousy royalty rates. Guess nothing's changed. So if he's hanging out and is comfortable, not living beyond his means, then I guess that movie deal really did pull in some big bucks for him. It was around the 5, 6 year mark of his hiatus after being let go by Capitol Records that the money ran out for him and he had to get back to work. This time, I think it's different. A fave folk-blues guitarist of mine said in an interview that his friendship with Bonnie Raitt and having her record one of his songs paid him quite well thru the years, that a smaller niche artist like himself can be successful. I'm going to guess that applies to Paul and if he's happy and financially comfortable right now, then great, he's earned it. An excerpt from Chris Smither interview, one of my fave finger style guitarists/songwriters: AF: You’ve had a remarkable career for more than a half century, and yet you seem to be in that category of Famous to a Few, an enthusiastic but relatively limited fan base. Is that an issue for you? Smither: When I was younger, I thought I’d be a household name. Absolutely. Then there came a time when I thought it was over and said, “I’m not going to get anywhere.” Eventually, I came out of that. I’m in a nice place now. I’ve got everything I want. I’m financially secure, and I’m happy. I get to do what I want to do. I’m in a place where I can work as much or as little as I want to. If I wanted to work 250 nights a year, I could. It wouldn’t be a problem. But I don’t want to work that hard anymore. AF: Being at peace with your career is a great thing. Smither: I tell younger musicians, and I tell their parents — who are worried that their kids are getting into music — “for god’s sake. You don’t have to be a household name to be a success in this business.” How many people know my name? I mean, a lot more than I would have dreamed at one point. But the fact is, I’m not super famous, and yet, I own my house, I put my kids through school. I’m not a hard-luck case by any means. People would be surprised to find out just how well you can do.artsfuse.org/188019/music-interview-singer-songwriter-chris-smither-coming-full-circle/
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Post by curmudgeonman on Jul 31, 2021 22:29:26 GMT -5
On the subject of Campbell's Ghost On The Canvas album, I'll bet Westy did not make a lot of money on this, not even close. In fact, I would be surprised if Campbell and his estate made six figures on it. The money in selling content is on CD and vinyl sales because of the royalty rates, but an extremely depressed market compared to streaming, which pays the artists basically nothing, not even a penny per play. Most artists do not make money on record sales because nobody buys CDs anymore like they did 20 years ago. And vinyl sales is a niche market. Artists make money touring, music placement in commercials and TV, and merchandise marketing. AFAIK, Paul is not involved in these aspects of the music business.
I have posted this before- The Bodyguard film soundtrack sold close to 50 MILLION copies (CD & vinyl) back in it's day, the BIGGEST selling soundtrack in history. Nick Lowe had one songwriting credit on the record, "What's So Funny 'Bout Peace, Love and Understanding". Fans assumed he became a millionaire from the soundtrack, set for life, but he admitted that it wasn't even close. He earned just enough to finance a European club tour later on, that's it. The money is gone in a flash.
Why are people like Bob Dylan, David Crosby, Lindsey Buckingham, Stevie Nicks, Chrissie Hynde, Neil Young, Steve Perry, Alice Cooper, Journey, Devo, etc. etc. have sold the rights to their songs? Touring has come to a halt in the last 1.5 years, no money coming in from CD sales, and streaming pays shit.
The music business is a different world compared to 10 years ago. Based on the current business model in the industry, I have no idea how Paul earns a living.
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Post by FreeRider on Aug 1, 2021 10:17:46 GMT -5
yeah, I remember now you posting that about Nick Lowe, really good point there. And it does make me wonder how the hell Paul can make a living if doesn't write more songs for others or for TV/movies. Open Season came out in 2006, so did the deal he make with Sony allow for him to live comfortably for 15 years? I looked on IMDB and saw that Open Season reportedly broke even in the US/CAN market, at around $85m, but world wide box office gross was listed at $200m. Did Paul get anything from that? I dunno
He didn't make much money from the reunion because the record label wanted to recoup some of their outstanding debt from the Mats and took their cut, and Jer pointed out that the boxed set stuff probably didn't move many units. And little checks here and there from royalties isn't a steady, recurring income stream.
And true, the economics have changed with less CD sales and more digital downloads, so I dunno how the artist can make money. I guess younger artists have Patreon sites and all, but still, how the hell do they make money outside of touring and selling merch?
Of course I'd like Paul to be financially rewarded somehow from the music biz---Tommy, Bob's family, Slim and Chris too--for their Mats output, but that shipped has sailed. But if Paul is content and doing okay, then he's earned his long hiatus.
Who knows what tomorrow will bring? Maybe he drops a ton of stuff on us out of economic necessity and as a farewell to us and his recording career. Maybe he starts writing for movies now...tomorrow never knows
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Post by Veets on Aug 3, 2021 16:45:52 GMT -5
Judging from that recently re-posted video of the Christmas shopping he did at Walgreen's, the guy can't even afford decent presents for his family. So sad. ;-)
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